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Wirecast large issue with multiple guests.

I am doing a political show with four remote guests and one on site host.  We setup the shots, (alot of them) and set rendezvous for them to log in.  They all log in but two of them can hear each other and the host, but not the other two guests.  The other two guests can hear each other and the host but not the other two guests.  This has happened three times so far and we had to cancel a show because of it. 
WHAT WE TRIED
we restarted the computer completely and restored the rendezvous session.  We disconnected the rendezvous session and waited five min and started a brand new session.   Returning guest don't seem to have to wait to get let back into once they have been on before.
I tried manually kicking everyone out of the rendezvous session and then making a new one.  The same thing keeps happening. 

Now everyone can SEEE each other and they can all hear the host, but half cannot hear the other half.

I looked into skype or zoom but you can really bring on multiple people and get a good video and audio and put them in different shots.

Is there a refresh sessions to started everyone from starch.  I think the two that CAN hear each other were on a show a few weeks ago and the two that can't are the new guests.  Is there a way to reset everyone as a new guest?

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  • Have you updated to Wirecast 14.1.1 Windows or 14.1.2 Mac?
    Is there a pattern to which guests can't hear which other guests?

    Joseph Boy said:
    started a brand new session. 

     

    Joseph Boy said:
    making a new one. 

     What about disconnecting and reconnecting those guests who can't hear other guests to the same session?

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    • CraigS I have disconnected all persons and then started a new session and that  did not fix it.

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    • CraigS I am using Wirecast 14.1.1 Windows which I purchased the pro version two weeks ago after viewing the software.  Very excited about what it can do.

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      • CraigSModerator
      • Telestream Desktop Forum Moderator
      • CraigS
      • 1 mth ago
      • Reported - view

      Joseph Boy What are the patterns with the guests specifically? 
      Which guests can hear which other guests?
      With that perhaps we can determine a pattern.

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    • CraigS Setup on Friday night for show starts at 5:00pm  Turn on all Android cell phones with NDI broadcasting so host shots are ready.  Setup green screens. Test each shot to ensure it was the same as last time.  See if guest wants teleprompter scripts or preview and live shot from Wirecast.  (he selected wirecast)  Setup monitor inside teleprompter to have multi viewer output.  (BTW Each time Wirecast has crashed is when enabling or changing mutli  viewer outputs.)  Test local mics on PreSonus STUDIOLIVE AR16c board.  Get the guest list.  configure the Director and Host stream decks with the names of the guest and adjust all single guest shots with their names and title.  Adjust all side by side shot for each guest with the host and each guest with each other. Start the Rendezvous session at 6:00pm  four guests are scheduled and two backups just in case.  They come in.  As each one comes in I now need to adjust and add them to each of the shots, singled, double with the guest, and double with each of the other guests.  (this takes alot of time because their info is not saved)  Once we have all the panelist in the session I request mic checks to ensure everything is going through my board correctly. 
      SIDENOTE configuration of the sound and rendezvous. After watching tons of your and others videos I selected to have my system sound to to the board on channels 1/2 and send the rendezvous on a second sound card.  That card is then sent to the board on channel 9/10 and muted from the mix.  But turned on for monitoring so the host can hear it from his headset. he can hear the system sound, and the local mics plus the 9/10 from rendezvous in his headset.  This is also sent to myself and anyone in the gallery that is watching.  /ENDSIDENOTE
      They I do a 30 second recording to have each person  do a sound check and verify that the recording matches what I am hearing.  Each one talks including the host and then the last 10 seconds they are to talk over each other to ensure we can get interruptions.  (You do this way better than zoom does)  Then I play back the recording allow them to each determine if they could hear themselves well and liked how they sounded.  (some are business owners and big wigs and want to feel they have a say on how they sound)  At this point we start to get questions about not hearing each other.  I adjust the multiviewer to match the camera shots that we have edited and it crashes.  I tell wirecast to do a recover so I don't loose my last two hours of shot edits and bring it back up.  Everyone comes back in and they are reporting not being able to hear each other.  Two thee were on the week before did not need to be approved to be let in.  (They did you the new link) I think said I was closing the session and needed to send everyone a new link.  We did that twice with five minutes in between.  We are now at 7:00 when we are supposed to be recording.  Tempers are getting there and I get them to agree to allow me to reboot the system.  I save the workspace so I don't loose the shots and reboot.  I make a new session and spend the links. Then all get back in without needing to be approved.  So I disconnect each one from the session and make yet another session.  They all join in and the situation is the same.  The first two people (1 and 2) are able to hear each other and the second two people (3 and 4) that came in (at the start of the day) can hear each other.  number 2 is a doctor and is on a secure network and he has a P denoting using your proxy server.  He can still hear 1 and the host.  3 and 4 are able to hear the host and myself but not 1 and 2. 3 is an FBI agent but went home to avoid their network.  I decide to attempt to directly pipe the feed on their audio to the board (risking feedback) and they still cannot hear them.  We restart one more time and the host calls it. Apologizes to the doctor and the business executives for wasting their time and that we will resolve the new software issues with the director (ME) can get his act together.
      I am open to ideas on how to resolve issues quickly when everyone is trying to get the job done.  I do not enjoy being the butt of the joke when things fail, especially when I spend two hours testing and getting everything ready and checked twice to ensure we get a good product. First I want to find a solution to the main issue.  Next I want to see if i followed the correct trouble shooting that would be expected.  I always attempt to efficient in my workflow and quick (5 min or less) in recover when I encounter a problem. 
      On a positive note. When ai researched your software I was impressed and talked to alot of people that said it was awesome. But I did not find anyone that used it for remote guests. Here is the cizzle reel I made with zoom when were had starting equipment. https://www.dropbox.com/s/ossn0zfr44uw9yo/Cizzel%20FINAL%20REALLY%20v5.mp4?dl=0 But because of how your software elevates the quality of production, we invested alot in sound, monitors, computers and quality cell phones and we made https://www.dropbox.com/s/ocnmiz1tq9kwyrc/CFL%20header%20for%20Cancel%20Culture.mp4?dl=0 It is not perfect. I learned the sound was a real issue because I want monitoring the sound from the board and not from the recording. This is why we now record for 30 seconds and review it. What a difference two weeks made. Just think of how it will be when I learn how to make custom lower thirds etc. (in two more weeks) But I need to correct issues or find work arounds to ensure we do not loose our guests before them get on to record.
      That is about as detailed as I can get for the workflow and what broke where.  I hope that helps. I also attached the setup with current version of wirecast on a water cooled computer in studio with teleprompter and two stream decks with presonus board, three android cell phones two computers running the time clocks and sending through NDI and two people behind my seat on wireless mice running the clocks.  I hope to hear possible solutions soon. We will be doing a mock test today with four people just to work on the rendezvous system. But they wont be the same guests for the next friday show.

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  • Joseph Boy said:
    (BTW Each time Wirecast has crashed is when enabling or changing mutli  viewer outputs.) 

     

    Joseph Boy said:
    I adjust the multiviewer to match the camera shots that we have edited and it crashes. 

     

    If Wirecast is crashing you may want to start a separate post on this issue so we can troubleshoot that as well.

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    • CraigS I will do, I some other minor issues I will do that for those as well.  But to add to my post earlier. Today at 3:30 I did a full run through to practice the setup break down and running of the show.  Got everyone in a 3:30 and 30 min later was able to get all my shots made and a sound check.  So twice as fast as last time.  Then we did the rendezvous and guess what!! it all worked. I tried to break it by adding 10 monitors to the multi output and I could not make it mess  up.  Then I did a local recording and a live broadcast on facebook at the same time and that worked.  Then I tried to stop the steam to facebook only and well that did not work.  No matter how many times I pressed the button it would not stop streaming and this is crashed.!! Yes it crashed so I could test about how the rendezvous will fail when I come back.  So I shut it all down and 56 seconds later turned it all back on and everyone was still in the rendezvous talking to each other like they are supposed to.   So I made it crash two more times but it still did not mess up the rendezvous.  So I have a show this Friday and will update the post if it messes up again.  Thanks.

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      • CraigSModerator
      • Telestream Desktop Forum Moderator
      • CraigS
      • 1 mth ago
      • Reported - view

      Joseph Boy  This is what our investigation findings are so far:

      • The issue only for Firefox guests, where some of them could not hear other session guests.
      • Switching remote audio mute button for not hearable guests, makes the audio work. The remote audio mute button has a reversed logic in that case. When button shows un-muted state, the remote guest is not hearable and when muted, it can be heard.


      If you see this issue again please test this. 

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  • Joseph Boy said:
    Then we did the rendezvous and guess what!! it all worked.

     Hmm. That's good to hear. 

    Joseph Boy said:
      So I made it crash two more times but it still did not mess up the rendezvous.

     At least that confirms it's independent of and has no impact on Rendezvous.

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  • Ok so the gremlins have come back.  I just upgraded to Wirecast 14.2 and still have been running issues with guests on rendezvous.  We find that guests have varied computers and we cannot force them to all have the same kind.  They range from apple to pc with firefox and chrome.  We are still getting issues when people not being able to hear each other.  We request them to download firefox and those that do can all hear and see each other.  Those that don't or don't know how have a 50/50 chance of seeing the rest of the people. We have had safari connect to firefox on pc and mac on a chrome on mac but not a chrome on pc.  we have had a cell android conntect to safari on a mac but not chrome on a pc or chrome on a mac. Wirecast go is also crazy not everyone is happy about having to reboot their device.  (But so far that is the only way we have been able to get links to work) Also don't use facebook for send links it has to be an email opened link in safari browser.  I will report more as I get it.  But figured you would like to see what we have tried.  We have also tried putting one person on zoom.  The rendezvous people can here the zoom people but the zoom people cannot hear the rendezvous people.  GRRRR (using six computers and wired gigabit network.)

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  • Joseph Boy said:
    We find that guests have varied computers and we cannot force them to all have the same kind. 

     Sorry but we need specifics. We can't troubleshoot general comments.

    Joseph Boy said:
    We request them to download firefox and those that do can all hear and see each other.

     Please reread what I posted. In our testing it is FireFox that exhibits the issue. Start by making sure none of the guests are using FireFox.

    When you run into this issue please document OS, and Browser (including version).
    Stick to the issue of who can hear who. 

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  • Joseph Boy said:
    Also don't use facebook for send links

     You must describe in complete detail. Perhaps you mean Facebook Messenger. The issue is with Messenger so we can't fix that. 

    Joseph Boy said:
    t has to be an email opened link in safari browser.

     Any email works fine. Text messages also work fine. Any other method seems to work except Facebook Messenger.

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  • CraigS said:
     Sorry but we need specifics. We can't troubleshoot general comments.

     Ok panelist 1 on chrome with mac panelist 2 on safari on mac panelist 3 on Edge with a pc cannot see panelist 1 and vice versa.  Switch Panelist 3 to firefox and they can see and hear them.  Panelist four on wirecast go with ipad.  (video turned upside down) cannot see panelist 1 and vice versa.  switch Panelist 4 to mac computer with safari and all is well.

    Another session.  Panelist 1 on on chrome with mac panelist 2 on safari on mac panelist 3 on Opra with PC and panelist four on secure network at hospital with mac with safari.  Panelist 4 and 3 cannot see or hear each other. Panelist 4 changes to cell phone and still can see each other.  Panelist 3 switches to edge and still does not work panelist 3 switches to firefox and it works for ten minutes then crashes and we are out of time for recording.

    another session. Panelist 1 on safari on mac, panelist 1 on chrome with mac, panelist 3 on android cell phone panelist 4 on wirecast go on ipad. panelist 4 cant see panelist 3 and vice versa panelist 3 starts having internet issues.  (yelling at son in background about playing games during his show) Son rips out cable and panelist 3 is gone.  replacement panelist 3 has safari on a mac and cannot see panelist 4.  Panelist 4 switchs to wirecast go on cell phone .  still cannot see panelist 3.  panelist 3 switches to firefox can see everyone.  12 mins in he gets disconnected (I switch scenes so no one knoews) and he comes back.  This time panelist 3 can hear everyone but the host. (told us by text because we were live in the show)(we texted me all the questions to make it look right) 

    another session  Panelist 1 on safari on mac.  panelist 2 on safari on mac, panelist 3 on firefox with pc panelist 4 on pc with chrome.  Everything works except panelist 4 is laggy.  We laugh and mention the kid from last week tying up the internet so panelist 4 gets on his sons gaming computer with wired network and no lag.  Everyone is working YEAH!! then panelist 2 gets off for a phone call and replacement panelist 2 gets on with safari on mac.  panelist 2 cannot see panelist 4.  ARRGGGG  panelist 2 switches to firefox and now he can see everyone and it is all working. 

    As you can see at first I just thought it sucked to be panelist 3, but later when we did seven it still was all over the place.  (Dont have the details on that one because it did not last long with tempers and I did not get the info from the guests.)

    Does that help for specifics??

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  • Joseph Boy said:
    mac panelist 2 on safari on mac panelist 3 on Edge

     We don't recommend either Safari or Edge as they may not have full WebRTC compatibility.

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      • Joseph Boy
      • Joseph_Boy
      • 12 days ago
      • Reported - view

      CraigS not trying to be a pain: but not safari not edge, not firefox.  So only chrome or opera??  What other options are there?

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      • CraigSModerator
      • Telestream Desktop Forum Moderator
      • CraigS
      • 11 days ago
      • Reported - view

      Joseph Boy At this point I'd say only Chrome as I'm not sure we've fully tested Opera. We're investigating dealing with FireFox. While Safari and Edge are improving their WebRTC support we haven't fully tested them yet either. We have found a number of compatibility issues in the past.  I am discussing all this with the developers.

      Facebook Messenger is an issue because of how it points to browser links especially on iOS but maybe elsewhere. That we can't fix though.
       

      Sending links by email and text message works. BTW iCloud Notes (which is free and cross-platform as it works in Windows as a browser app) also works. 

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