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14b: certain change will slow workflow

If I can say, I totally disagree with the approach of using percentage in crop. Using point was so useful for calculation, now with percentage all is a guess.

As well, I'm totally disappointed with the size in percentage of the shot being completely removed in favor of the jog. This may be good for unexperienced user, but removing completing the possibility to enter the size manually and see the size in percentage is a big mistake.

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  • Ermanno Bonifazi  , Lutz Conneus : Thanks for that feedback. Do you find the new size width/height boxes helpful--where you can set the size of your bounding box by pixel?

    Also, trying to understand: What is the task that you were doing before that's been limited in this new UI?

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    • lynn_elliott I'm still a little confused how that concept is designed. I tested only with the cropped source and really was not behaving as expected. I will test more asap with not cropped sources. The importance of entering dimension is relevant: for example I have template that need 4 source in a shot, so I know that setting all the sources at 50% will perfectly fit the scene, as well I can enter proper proportion for source (like one at 25 and the other at 50) when I have media and cameras, and similar cases. The jog is nice but really inconvenient for this need. Also, using the jog, the lines that divide the canvas in four (the yellow lines) never appear, so for example, to fit 4 sources perfectly you have to do it manually stretching the sources. Also I have many shots where I have 2 guest, so having the dimension % was making easy to make them the exact same size.

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    • Ermanno Bonifazi I'm not fighting against the jog to be clear, I think having the option to use the jog that change the size and being displayed in a "connected" size field, but having also the ability to enter the size manually could be a great solution.

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    • Ermanno Bonifazi Got it. Jog wheel is ok, but you want to be able to enter the size of your media manually. What I want to understand is whether the new Size width and height boxes achieve that for you? And if not, what is missing for you there?

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    • lynn_elliott Pixel instead of the percentage will require manual calculation every time, especially when canvas size will be resized/changed.

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    • lynn_elliott I tested with a more regular sources (full screen no letter box) and the FILL work as expected. I still believe btw that missing the percentage resize is a weak point. I personally also was liking more the crop in pixel than in percentage, since for specific sources pixel crop are known in advance. Anyway percentage need just a little more attempt to guess the correct crop, not a big point as percentage of resize imho.

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  • lynn_elliott said:
    Do you find the new size width/height boxes helpful--where you can set the size of your bounding box by pixel?

    I have no task for it - for me the bounding box is the size of the source, there is no need to change that. BUT different user different workflows.

     

    EDIT: what is your idea for that? lynn_elliott

     

    lynn_elliott said:
    What is the task that you were doing before that's been limited in this new UI?

    We have a graphical design for a 2-box shot and I know the size of a source is min. 63% - so it is very easy to type that in than to use the jog. I like the jog because after I type in 63% I mostly scale the source a little bit up.

    Another example: If I would scale two sources to the same size it is easier with values.

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    • Lutz Conneus HI Lutz. This new UI is different for sure - but I want to make sure you're not losing functionality, or that we're not making it harder for you... the intent with it is that you have MORE control-- not less. For example, in the new UI, instead of sizing a source at 63%, you can now type into the Size field the exact dimensions you want your source to be. So, for example - if you want your source to be the same as the canvas size (say 1280x720), you would type 1280 and 720 into the Size box. If you want two sources to be the same size, you could type 640x720 for each of them.  Does that work for you?

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    • lynn_elliott thanks you for your answer. I know is have the same functionality. It works for me but it slows the workflow, now in my workflow I have to type in 1210 and 680 instead of 63%... but again: It is fine for me :-)

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    • Lutz Conneus Gotcha. I understand what you're saying... 

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    • Greg Kuhnert
    • wirecast.community
    • Greg_Kuhnert
    • 2 yrs ago
    • Reported - view
    lynn_elliott said:
    This new UI is different for sure - but I want to make sure you're not losing functionality, or that we're not making it harder for you... the intent with it is that you have MORE control-- not less

    Why not allow double boxes - allow people to chose which metric to adjust, and have it auto update the alternate corresponding controls?

    Greg Kuhnert

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  • I'd love to see the percentage box come back for scaling!

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  • Jeff James Is it for the same reason as Lutz has for wanting this: to only type in one number instead of 2?

    What if we provided an aspect ratio lock - so you only had to type in one number (e.g. width), and the other would be set automatically to keep your aspect ratio?

    I'm trying to understand what makes memorizing/setting a % easier than memorizing/setting a pixel number...

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    • lynn_elliott Becouse the majority of us as streamer consider the dimensione of a source in the canvas as percentage of occupation of the space. Pixel works for programmers not for users. And as I mentioned using pixel will force to recalculate if you want to build another template with different canvas size but with similar "shot layout idea". Clearly the idea of connecting the two field in some way is a patch but I still believe instead the linking the jog with a percentage field and viceversa will be much more appreciated from users. It could be late for the stage of development but you can place a poll on the Wirecast user group in FB and this will give you a better feeling from a larger user base than us. I sense anyway that if the percentage will be totally removed for the size of the shot many users will not appreciate. But again is only my personal opinion and not a fact. 

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    • Ermanno Bonifazi thank you for that explanation. that helps

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    • lynn_elliott What Ermanno Bonifazi said.

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    • Greg Kuhnert
    • wirecast.community
    • Greg_Kuhnert
    • 2 yrs ago
    • Reported - view
    lynn_elliott said:
    I'm trying to understand what makes memorizing/setting a % easier than memorizing/setting a pixel number...

    When you're moving a crop for example you can see with your eyes that there is 1 pixel left to crop. The human brain does not know what percentage that is, nor does it make sense to do the math of the percentage calculations. Which brings the next question. Fractional percentages are not supported... So on a purely practical perspective, how could you do a right crop a 1280px720p image by 17 pixels. This is something I have in an existing web source with a scroll bar. Assuming you can only crop by percentages, that means a minimum crop resolution of 12.8 pixels. Its either under or over cropped. Thats the problem. I do LIKE the idea of percentage cropping, but I believe it probably requires dual fields - for pixel and percentage, with a change in one updating the other automatically - and the ability to have decimal points on percentages....

    Greg Kuhnert

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    • Greg Kuhnert I agree. I mentioned in fact in the first message that also imho crop was better in pixel.

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  • Thanks for all your input here. We have made some changes that will allow you to size media either by W/H pixels OR % (as before). 

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    • lynn_elliott This sound great. We (at least I) appreciate hearing the feedback from the customers.

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    • lynn_elliott Thanks for making this happen in v.14. 

      Like 1
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