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I LOVE ScreenFlow, but three issues are preventing me from leaving Premiere behind.

I absolutely love ScreenFlow's intuitiveness, I've recently recorded & edited an entire Video series with it for a company called PreSonus Audio Electronics. The only thing that was annoying is the fact that I could've been so much faster in getting this job done if I didn't have to switch between ScreenFlow and Premiere all the time. The three main reasons for that were:

1. No proper Video Filters to color-correct DSLR camera footage beyond the absolute basics.

2. (much more severe): HUGE color inaccuracies. Nothing that ScreenFlow exports looks quite like what was imported - No matter in which format you export (and I've tried them all...ProRes, h264, HEVC...). This makes white balancing etc. an absolute nightmare. 

3. Nesting is great...but why do nested clips have to have an independent timeline?! This would be such a great feature to quickly merge your task bar-hiding screenshot with your screen capture. But nesting becomes a crazy headache when you're doing this too early on in editing. As soon as you start splitting nested clips, you're screwed!

...my two cents. ScreenFlow is being so, so close to being a sensational platform. As soon as these features are implemented, I feel that it can truly become serious competition for the current industry standards (at least when it comes to content creation - movie making is another story).

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    • CraigSModerator
    • Telestream Desktop Forum Moderator
    • CraigS
    • 2 yrs ago
    • Reported - view
    Gregor Beyerle said:
    1. No proper Video Filters to color-correct DSLR camera footage beyond the absolute basics.

     Please describe what you'd like to see.

    Gregor Beyerle said:
    HUGE color inaccuracies.

     Encoders themselves can have an impact. 
    Can you record something as a color standard and then export as Lossless ProRes or ProRes 422 and compare. Please post the originals so they can be tested.

    Gregor Beyerle said:
    3. Nesting is great...but why do nested clips have to have an independent timeline?!

     Please explain further. Perhaps compare to another NLE.

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    • CraigSModerator
    • Telestream Desktop Forum Moderator
    • CraigS
    • 2 yrs ago
    • Reported - view

    X-Rite Color Checker Chart
    Held up to Facetime webcam and recorded in ScreenFlow 9.0.1 on macOS 10.14.6.
    Exported Apple ProRes 422
    Video in Quicktime sized to match the ScreenFlow canvas showing the chart.
    Screenshot of the two next to each other.
    There's a slight difference in luminance and maybe saturation although looks more to be luminance. And it's slight. Certainly not huge at all. Not seeing much of a hue shift if any at all.
     

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  • CraigS Check out this render from a h264 file. Big difference in luminance and contrast imho...

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  • CraigS "Please describe what you'd like to see."

    At the very least, I'd need to be able to adjust Hue curves / Hue to Saturation. 

    "Can you record something as a color standard and then export as Lossless ProRes or ProRes 422 and compare. Please post the originals so they can be tested."

    H264 Export posted below. Will follow up with ProRes. 

    "Please explain further. Perhaps compare to another NLE."

    I'm not sure what NLE means...but I would love to just "group" Layers & be able to apply actions & crossfades to them as if they were one, without having to open up a separate timeline through nesting, which can get extremely tricky if you're not careful. Even members from your team admitted so. 

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  • CraigS  ...and here's with ProRes lossless export. Still not even close to the original. Red colors extremely exaggerated. This does not happen when I export as ProRes in FinalCut or Premiere.

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    • CraigSModerator
    • Telestream Desktop Forum Moderator
    • CraigS
    • 2 yrs ago
    • Reported - view

    Gregor Beyerle Note that H.264 and ProRes output themselves look different. This is being impacted by the encoder. Encoders do change things. We have to differentiate between the Encoder (x264 and ProRes are standards, ours are generally not unique).

    A good test would be using a source file and encoding it to Apple ProRes 422 in Finder and importing that source file into a new ScreenFlow document and exporting it as Apple ProRes 422. If the results don't match it can determine ScreenFlow's impact.

    Gregor Beyerle said:
    At the very least, I'd need to be able to adjust Hue curves / Hue to Saturation. 

     That makes sense. Curves and/or Color Wheels.

    Gregor Beyerle said:
    I'm not sure what NLE means.

     Non Linear Editor. Premiere, FCPX, Resolve, iMovie, ScreenFlow, etc.

    Gregor Beyerle said:
    would love to just "group" Layers & be able to apply actions & crossfades to them as if they were one, without having to open up a separate timeline through nesting,

     That can be difficult in some cases. Screen captures involve metadata from the OS/GPU relationship which include cursor information and data which allow foreground and background eliminate to be handled separately. This information can't be joined even when nested so the individual clips still need to be treated. 

    It's one thing to Nest two MP4 files. It's another when the Nest includes Screen Capture and/or webcam capture. Many of our Actions require that specific metadata on a per clip basis. So you may be able to Nest and move the Nest with Video Action but a Callout or Screen Recording Action can't be used unless applied to the clip because each clip's metadata is different and can't be joined. 

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    • CraigSModerator
    • Telestream Desktop Forum Moderator
    • CraigS
    • 2 yrs ago
    • Reported - view

    Recorded my ColorCheck with FaceTime in Quicktime. 
    Recording is H.264 720p at 10Mb/s

    Converted that file to Apple ProRes by right clicking file in Finder and selecting Encode Selected Video Files.
    The resultant file was Apple ProRes 422.

    Imported the H.264 720p 10Mb/s file into ScreenFlow and placed in timeline
    Export to Apple ProRes 422.

    To compare the Finder ProRes file to ScreenFlow ProRes file from the same source I opened them in Quicktime and took a screenshot.

    Quicktime ProRes encode on the left looks the same as ScreenFlow ProRes encode on the right.
     

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    • CraigSModerator
    • Telestream Desktop Forum Moderator
    • CraigS
    • 2 yrs ago
    • Reported - view

    Original on the Left, Finder ProRes encode in the middle, ScreenFlow ProRes encode on the right.

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  • CraigS I did the exact same thing. Finder ProRes encode on the right, then imported into ScreenFlow, which is on the left. I took the screenshot by putting the QuickTime window next to the ScreenFlow timeline preview. 

     

    Immediately there's a HUGE color difference. ScreenFlow added loads of red.

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  • CraigS Could you please do me a favor and download the following file (1 frame of my Quicktime recording, which was converted to ProRes via Finder): https://www.dropbox.com/s/q3dam64pe1lp6fj/DSLR%20Quicktime%20Recording%20%28converted%20to%20ProRes%29.mov?dl=0

     

    ....then import it into an empty ScreenFlow project, open it up in Quicktime also and put them side by side. Then take a Screenshot please.

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    • CraigSModerator
    • Telestream Desktop Forum Moderator
    • CraigS
    • 2 yrs ago
    • Reported - view

    Gregor Beyerle 

    Gregor Beyerle said:
    open it up in Quicktime also and put them side by side. Then take a Screenshot please.

    This would not be a proper test.
    You want to compare exports not the display in ScreenFlow.

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    • CraigSModerator
    • Telestream Desktop Forum Moderator
    • CraigS
    • 2 yrs ago
    • Reported - view

    Gregor Beyerle 
    I'd really need the source file and do a conversion in Finder and in ScreenFlow to ProRes and compare.

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  • CraigS Aside from the question how one is supposed to white balance if the ScreenFlow display is not to be trusted, it still looks different yet again when being exported in ScreenFlow. I've attached a link to the source file above so you can double check this on your end. 

    Gregor Beyerle said:
    Could you please do me a favor and download the following file (1 frame of my Quicktime recording, which was converted to ProRes via Finder): https://www.dropbox.com/s/q3dam64pe1lp6fj/DSLR%20Quicktime%20Recording%20%28converted%20to%20ProRes%29.mov?dl=0

    ....then import it into an empty ScreenFlow project, open it up in Quicktime also and put them side by side. Then take a Screenshot please.

     

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  • CraigS ...here is also the original h264 file, in case you want to do the Finder conversion to ProRes on your end also: https://www.dropbox.com/s/0q6p74v13dt9o6h/DSLR%20Quicktime%20Test%20%28original%20h264%29.mov?dl=0

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  • CraigS here is a Screenshot of the QuickTime ProRes Conversion vs the ScreenFlow ProRes Render.

     

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    • CraigSModerator
    • Telestream Desktop Forum Moderator
    • CraigS
    • 2 yrs ago
    • Reported - view

    Left your file converted in Finder to Apple ProRes
    Right ScreenFlow conversion of your file to Apple ProRes
     

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    • CraigSModerator
    • Telestream Desktop Forum Moderator
    • CraigS
    • 2 yrs ago
    • Reported - view

    Original, Finder Conversion, ScreenFlow Conversion

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    • CraigSModerator
    • Telestream Desktop Forum Moderator
    • CraigS
    • 2 yrs ago
    • Reported - view

    Gregor Beyerle What you're showing are PNG so they've been through another conversion.

    My screenshots are of the ProRes files themselves in Quicktime and the three shot is your H.264 file.

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    • CraigSModerator
    • Telestream Desktop Forum Moderator
    • CraigS
    • 2 yrs ago
    • Reported - view

    Gregor Beyerle I thought I did. I downloaded your H.264 file and did my own conversions. Two Shot. And compared against your original. Three Shot.

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  • CraigS Are you seriously telling me you're not seeing this? Look at the right one of this Screenshot that you yourself posted! It has way less saturation and a lot more red. You'd have to be color blind to not see this.

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  • CraigS sorry, my mail inbox only notified me of your one reply. I didn't see that you already did (and confirmed) the comparison yourself.

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    • CraigSModerator
    • Telestream Desktop Forum Moderator
    • CraigS
    • 2 yrs ago
    • Reported - view

    Gregor Beyerle Encodes are going to look different than the H.264 source.

    You have to compare Finder vs ScreenFlow ProRes encode.
    Comparing source H.264 to either encode and that will look different but that only shows that Apple ProRes encoder itself will alter with output.

    Comparing Source with the Two Encodes (3 shot) shows that both Finder and ScreenFlow ProRes encoder alters the shot similarly. 
     

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  • CraigS 

    CraigS said:
    Left your file converted in Finder to Apple ProRes Right ScreenFlow conversion of your file to Apple ProRes

     ...I truly hope that you see the significant loss of saturation & increase of red in the ScreenFlow conversion? 

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  • CraigS 

    CraigS said:
    Comparing Source with the Two Encodes (3 shot) shows that both Finder and ScreenFlow ProRes encoder alters the shot similarly. 

    You can't be serious. Are you talking about THIS: https://s3-us-west-2.amazonaws.com/media.forumbee.com/i/3060051e-055b-459e-84a8-7aa536a20b21/h/547.png

    I quote: "Original, Finder Conversion, ScreenFlow Conversion"

    ...and you're honestly saying that ScreenFlow's conversion on the right did an equally good job to Finder's conversion in the middle? Sorry, not even close!

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  • CraigS 

    CraigS said:
    [...] both Finder and ScreenFlow ProRes encoder alters the shot similarly. 

     I believe it's pretty obvious that Finder conversion stays WAY closer to the original colors than ScreenFlow does.

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